SPEAKER_00 0:01

I have a few questions for you. You'll have to let me know how many of these feel true to you. So, are you somebody that tends to avoid conflict like the plague? Like you would do anything to avoid conflict. Are you known for being pretty calm and steady? Do you ever say yes when you really want to say no? Do you work really hard but don't necessarily like being the center of attention? And lastly, are you somebody that tends to go with the flow rather than rock the boat? If any of these ring true for you, you might be an Enneagram type nine. And today we are opening the case file, our Enneagram case file on the type 9, the harmonizer, the peacemaker, the mediator energy. And uh going just to get an overview of a little bit more about that type. And then we are also going to hear from an Enneagram 9 informant about what life is like on the inside. So I'm looking forward to sharing this with you. Um, this is part of a series that a LinkedIn live series that we did over um this winter. It's still very applicable. And I've um gotten some good feedback, um, both over on YouTube and then from those that had watched it live. And so I thought um I want to make sure that you hear some of this too, especially these real life informant encounters, um, just really gave some additional um perspective and it was just helpful and better understanding that type and how it presents itself in some of us um in in real life in the workplace. So, without further ado, let's jump in to this case file, open up the case file, and then um get ready to hear from our informant Tim Brokop. You're listening to the Enneagram MBA podcast, a show about understanding people at work, including yourself. I'm your host, Sarah Wallace, and I'm excited to be diving into this week's episode with you. Welcome to this week's Enneagram Case Files, where we are diving into the type 9 um file today, just learning a little bit more specifically about this energy, whether it's one that you are trying to understand. Am I a type nine or another type? Or maybe you already know you're a type nine and just trying to understand and learn a little bit more about yourself, or maybe you have a type nine on your team or happen to live with one. Um, we're gonna learn a little bit more about what does that mean? What is it like to work next to them, how to work best with them. And uh to help us do that, we do have a type nine informant today. So that'll be fun. We'll get to that in just a second. I'm your host, Sarah Wallace, um, owner of the Enneagram MBA, which is a team training company. I love to bring the Enneagram into the workplace for workshops, staff development days. Um, because, you know, I always say we've spent so much time learning about other people. Um, how much time do we really get to learn about ourselves? So I love when companies dedicate time to helping us learn about ourselves. And then by doing so, we have a chance to also understand all the other ways people are viewing the world. Um, our type nine is known as the peacemaker. And uh we'll we'll get into what that looks like here in just a second. Um, here's kind of the basic rundown for those of you who may not know, um, or just to kind of to get us all on the same page here. Our type nines tend to be striving to feel at peace. And they are looking for harmony and peace within and externally. So I'm excited to hear from our informant today, kind of how that shows up. Um, they tend to be really focused on kind of everybody else. What does everybody else think? What are they doing? What do they need? And sometimes type nines get a reputation or the lay the label as being lazy. Um, when in fact, sometimes that's true. Type nines I do hear sometimes resonate with that. Others not at all. They're very busy, but sometimes where that will come from is just their asleep to themselves. And so the growth work for the type nine will kind of be waking up to understanding before I can even speak up, I need to understand who I am, what do I, what do I want, um, and start to voice those. Even even little things like where you want to go for dinner, I know sometimes can cause stress for the nines. Um, we have talked with type eight last week in our case file. Um, and sometimes they can be known as natural leaders, but all types can be a leader. And so we'll actually hear a little bit more from our informant on that front as well. Um, that our type nines have this superpower in leadership on a team as being incredibly inclusive and being really able to live in the gray. They don't have to have things kind of black or white. They you won't hear them a lot of times saying kind of my way or the highway energy. Um it's, you know, kind of looking at the consensus, what does everybody else think, and then making a decision as a team. Um, they tend to be pretty steady and calm. Um, sometimes, though, because of all the managing of other people's opinions and feelings and thoughts and suppressing their own or just being out of touch, um, it can feel almost wrong then to be annoyed or angry. And so sometimes they'll shove that down and it could come across as passive aggressive. I know nine sometimes will say that they they can be a little stubborn and those in their life will agree. Um, sometimes the nine is kind of, I think of them as the Hulk. Um, you know, calm, calm, cool, collect most of the time. But then once they get to that level, that that Hulk, Hulk energy might come out. Um, and then just because they tend to be a little bit more optimistic and maybe even kind of conflict avoidant, not always, but sometimes um in a in a conflict situation or when they're running into a problem, sometimes the tendency will be to think, what problem? and just kind of avoid it or numb out to it. Um, and to to learn a little bit more about what this actually looks like in real life, right? So this is Enneagram kind of theory. These are commonalities between other people. We're going to bring in a Enneagram informant. Uh, Tim Bro cop is going to be filling us in here on what is life really like on the inside as a type nine. So, Tim, welcome to our Enneagram case file series. Would you just briefly introduce yourself?

SPEAKER_01 7:24

Sure. Um, I am, I guess, somewhat of a serial entrepreneur, which is a I hate that term because yeah, it's gotten overused a bit, but um, you know, it does tie in a little bit to me being a nine. But uh most of my life I have worked in the nonprofit world and in the last five years have jumped into what was a tech startup and now is a full-blown uh org that's running um uh called Blink. So yeah, so a little bit of uh of everything in that regard, uh, but it's I'm happy to be on the show, Sarah. I love all things Enneagram. My wife is a uh spiritual director, and it's something that we talk about all the time uh within our relationship, and um obviously it spills over to my professional life too. So great to be here.

SPEAKER_00 8:15

Well, I I appreciate you being here, and we will um I'm actually going to be reaching out to your wife, so maybe we'll be hearing her hearing from her for the type four series.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

Uh-oh.

SPEAKER_00 8:25

Um, but I would love to hear just kind of that that whole like Enneagram in real life. How does it show up for you? How did you know I'm a nine?

SPEAKER_01 8:37

Yeah, I mean, you know, it's only probably been in the past five or six years that I've really became aware of the Enneagram, started studying it because of my wife's professional side, it became you know a large part of our conversations interpersonally, and then also in our relationships, you know, and you know, close circle of friends, but then you know, talking about um our professional relationships and how that sort of comes up in that. Um, and you know, I've known my whole life that I've been a peacemaker that has been um you know innate within me is that I hated um when things I I don't want to say that I hated conflict because I don't know if I hate conflict, but I certainly do not enjoy people not getting along. Um, and so as we sort of jumped in and started studying it, it became very clear uh pretty quick that I was a nine in regards to the way that I approached what motivated me in my communication styles and my actions, the way they interact with others. It was, I mean, that was that wasn't very hard for me to figure out.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

So uh now if if you have any thoughts on this, I'd love to hear them. No pressure if not. But what I have found in my own Enneagram experience is that type nine tends to be one of the more difficult types for people to understand, or or type nines maybe struggle um more than some of the others in identifying their type. And they say it's because of that kind of that, oh, I can see all sides. So I can kind of see myself in all of these. Um, and I'm curious if there is one thing specifically or a piece of advice that you would give to somebody who is struggling to know, am I a type nine or am I a two or a six? Um, are some of the common ones that I hear a lot, but I I hear nines kind of kind of struggling between all of them. Um, anything that comes up for you?

SPEAKER_01 10:45

Um, well, you know, here's the deal. Um we we live in a misogynistic culture and world, and when you hear the type nine described, it it doesn't, you know, it rubs against everything that culture would say is a man, um, you know, to some extent. And there was some component to I was as I was, you know, reading it and studying it, and I, you know, inside I'm like, yeah, I'm a nine, but I didn't want to, because it's you know, in my in your mind, it's like, oh, that's the weak one. That's the one that can't, you know, can't do anything, is too passive, just sitting in a corner, is you know, afraid. Um, and I think that really important part of the whole Enneagram is to understand that you know, every every single one has strengths and weaknesses, and how you understand those and implement that is actually what allows for you to be strong and healthy and make an impact. Um, but you do have to set aside what I would consider would be some cultural biases when it comes to the description of the different uh you know terms. Like the the four is another one that is not very friendly to our cultural norms when it comes to you know uh men and women, right? Um, and so you have to be you just have to be aware that that is you have biases involved in that um and embrace it and learn that um you know if you can understand what's motivating and driving you, you actually that's where your impact and your strengths come. So that would be the two cents that I would give. Um, you know, I went kicking and screaming into adopting the fact that I'm a full-blown nine and I just need to, you know, get over it. So I don't know if that makes sense or not, but that would be some insight from my end.

SPEAKER_00 12:36

It does make sense. And there are some types that have, you know, more maybe like you were saying, stereotypical feminine energy or stereotypical masculine energy. And so it that absolutely can kind of influence how you're thinking about the types. Um, I'm curious, uh Tim, you know, being uh a serial entrepreneur and and leading um, you know, different projects and ventures and and teams, um, what is the strength of the nine energy that you have seen show up in your own experience?

SPEAKER_01 13:15

Um, well, I think the the biggest thing is that people feel safe around you, um, at least for me. Um, because of the nature, you're not overbearing, you don't come in, you know, guns ablazing. Uh, you set sort of a culture of calmness um and wherever you're at, and people feel safe, which allows for them to, you know, show their true colors. It also allows for them to um, you know, be who they really are at their core. I mean, there is uh a lot of strength that compassion and empathy are, at least for me, something that are is is somewhat natural in my leadership style. Um, and I think that that is attached to being a nine. Um, so there, you know, there's a lot that goes along with that. Obviously, I'm sure we'll get to that in a bit, the weaknesses that are involved also with being a nine when it comes to leading uh teams.

SPEAKER_00 14:13

Well, and that is actually my next question, Tim. So just curious, yeah, what maybe common, well, I don't know, if you want to say weakness or just kind of obstacle or struggle that you've noticed um with this energy in leading a company in in your work career life?

SPEAKER_01 14:34

Yeah, I think uh, you know, it's the whole frog in the you know in the pot scenario where you you're you're not willing to maybe admit soon enough that you know something is wrong and and we got to address it because you're you know you have this positive mindset, you're optimistic, everything is glass half full. Uh, but I do think that uh either your teammates or people you lead can be frustrated at times because it's sort of like, hey, the ship is thinking, you need we need to do something, and you're like, no, it'll be all right, we'll be fine. Then of course it's too late uh at some point before you identify some of those things. And what I would say for me is I had to learn um when I those inklings, right? Because they're inklings, it's not like someone's yelling, shouting in a bullhorn, you know, the ship is thinking like some of the other uh types would have. But inklings that you'd have, you have to be very sensitive and listen, listening to those, because those inklings are probably much louder to others than they are to you. Um, so I think the struggle then comes making sure that you aren't, you know, that frog in that that pot where the water just ends up boiling because you just get used to, you know, the temperature. So I don't know if that makes sense, but that would be probably the biggest challenge that I would say I consistently face.

SPEAKER_00 15:57

Okay, it does make sense, yes. Um, now I have a question about prioritizing and getting things done. And I think this is something all types, regardless if you identify as a type nine or not, can struggle with in different ways in different times. Um, it tends to be something I hear a lot come up for type nines, even the ones that are very active and do a lot. What I hear is sometimes I'm busy, but then I look back and I realize I wasn't busy on the right things or I wasn't doing the right things. Um, is that something that you have noticed, had noticed, you've grown through it? Any advice you would give to those of us, just kind of how you prioritize what needs to get done, either on a daily basis or as you're looking kind of at a project as a whole, any any tips on kind of productivity prioritizing from a nine perspective?

SPEAKER_01 16:53

Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, obviously experience is very helpful. You know, I'm a I think I can understand priorities uh much better than I did 20 years ago, right? Um, I am a wing eight, so that helps me. Um I'm I'm a very you know, I I I like to see things in order, have a goal and object, and sort of like these are the steps to get there. So it's I'm not a complete nine in that regard. Um, but I do think that if you want to, you know, focusing on what a priority is really boils down to um getting rid of the noise in your life, if I'm honest. You know, for me that looks like uh 10 to 15 minutes every morning of usually either you know some pause and silence, some journaling, or uh you know, reading some sort of I don't know, some some book or something that allows for me to slow down before jumping into my day. Because if I don't do that, I am it's it's obvious for me that my mind is not calm and settled. So, you know, as a nine, I would just say put some practices into your life that can sort of get the noises um, you know, to slow down the noises, blur the noises, um, clarify the noises, something that would allow for you to understand what's happening. Um, because otherwise you will, it's the tyranny of the urgent. I mean, you're just trying to run away from anything that you know causes any kind of tension in your in your heart or your mind. Uh it's not just conflict, honestly, it's anything along those lines.

SPEAKER_00 18:42

So well, and and that kind of leads me to another question. So I I I know you have done a lot of self-growth work. Um, it sounds like just based on our messages and before we were talking. And um, so this may not be where you're at right now. And so I'm curious what you've learned from this. But I'm also in this place where um having difficult conversations as a type seven too is incredibly uncomfortable. And I I I feel like I have some nine energy sometimes, or it's similar when it's like, oh, that's really bothering me, but gosh, I hate to bring it up. I don't I won't say anything, or this really needs to be said, but hate to like rock the boat or upset anybody, like let's just kind of uh you know shove it down or try to ignore it, but that never happens. I have I'm very much learning. You shove it down, shove it down until there's an explosion, which then it's just awful. So any kind of having difficult conversations, and maybe it's you know, reaching into our type wing or type eight wing bag here, but for for any of us who kind of find those kind of uncomfortable conversations difficult to address, any thoughts or uh advice for how you have learned to bring that up, whether it's with a team member, a significant other, you know, just dealing with with tension in general?

SPEAKER_01 20:11

Well, um, I would say I'm learning, you know, going back to being an adult for 25 uh plus years, uh, you know, you learn a lot. And one of the things you learn is exactly what you said. If you try to pretend like it's not there, it will show and it'll be twice as bad as it was as if you talked about it originally. Um, so there is just sort of some experience of, yeah, yeah, I gotta bring that up, otherwise it's gonna be a disaster. Um, but I do think that um, you know, that that's maybe part of the eight part of the pragmatic piece for me of just actually thinking through, okay, what is the you know, what is the end result if I don't bring this up? What what is gonna happen with that? And I use the term, you know, I know the the the word sloth or laziness is usually associated with the nine. And I would just say it's not necessarily that, I think I would say it's lack of courage. Um, and you know, really for me, identifying that listen, this requires some courage, that you have to, you know, have some guts and courage to do the right thing. Um, you know, uh for me identifies that, like, yeah, there's some this is hard, but it's the right thing. And you I I want to be known as a courageous person. Uh, that's one of the things that I would love to have, you know, on my tombstone, right? Is that Tim was a courageous person. He was never afraid to do the things that were hard because they were right. Um, and so it sort of motivates me in those times. Now, I say all that, and I still, you know, I'm always trying to, in my head, and you know, try to frame the conversation I'm gonna have, or you know, think about the conversation to have in a way that'll have a positive spin that'll. You know, well, maybe if I say it this way, it'll sound better. And, you know, the reality is there is some truth to that. Your words and how you present them do matter. And so I don't want to throw the baby out the bathwater. But what happens, and I have to guard myself on that, is I gotta ask myself, like, am I doing that because I'm afraid? Um, you know, to say the the truth or or do the right thing. And that's hard. I mean, that requires, you know, courage is is not is not easy. But you know, thinking about it that way makes it, I don't know, I don't say sound glamorous because that's not the word, but makes it sound much more awesome, you know, to do than if you're just like, uh, so that would be, you know, the way that I would think about it. It helps me at least.

SPEAKER_00 22:47

I love that. I've never heard it put quite like that about kind of the the courage to have that conversation, because of course it like it's going to be uncomfortable and there's going to be some fear around that. But you know, that's what courage is. You can't have courage without the fear. So I love that. Um, I want to talk about um growth and stress. So the Enneagram arrows are one of my favorite things, um, just because it um I think that's one of the things that makes the Enneagram unique is that kind of fluidity that it has, and that you're not just a stagnant type. It's what's going on in your life, um, how much growth work and self-reflection have you done over the years. So there's all kinds of ways that as our type we can present. And I know you've done a lot of work yourself, just for our um listeners or our viewers, um, just to kind of again start on the same page here with the nine growth arrows and what they call stress arrows sometimes is um for um a nine, sometimes they'll they'll call it the supporting strategy, is that type um is the type six energy, where um it's you know, the the type six tends to uh be really collaborative and um they can also be known for being a little anxious and worrying and always having a plan B, which is the opposite of the stereotypical type nine, um, being so calm, cool, and collect. So curious how you see that show up, or if you see that that six energy show up in those times of stress.

SPEAKER_01 24:36

Well, I think that you know, the one of the great things about being a nine is in a time of stress or when there's you know chaos happening is you sort of have this calm um sort of you know ability to sort of see clear clearly what's going on. Um I mean, and it is it is very helpful, you know. When the Titanic was going down, the nine probably understood pretty quick that, hey, listen, we only have you know nine rowboats and we need 900, right? So this is how we have to get the right people on the right boats at the right time, things like that. So when you start talking about stress, um, you know, I I don't think it necessarily for me comes from having a lot to do or something big to get done. Um because uh it's I can see pretty clearly what needs to like these are the steps that have to happen in order for this to be accomplished. I think where the stress comes into play for me is you know, who's it gonna affect how and when in that process, right? Um we've got to get the family from you know here to uh friend's house, but Johnny's hungry, and you know, whoever needs to buy a birthday gift for a party she's going to tomorrow. So, you know, the stress comes with how do you keep everyone happy yet still accomplish the goal of getting the family to your friend's house for dinner. Um, so I don't know if that answers that question in regards to stress, but it's yeah, I mean it it always boils down to you know who's gonna be happy and who's gonna be upset with actions that you have to take.

SPEAKER_00 26:21

That's so good. And even just thinking, yeah, at work, like your team, clients potentially. Um, so I like that. That was helpful. What about on the growth side? So again, we can kind of flow in and out of these. Um, for those that don't know, in growth, they say that a nine will start to not act like a three necessarily, but step into some of those um healthy qualities of a three. And sometimes it's known as the neglected number because threes tend to be, you know, in this okay in the spotlight and okay sharing their opinion and going fast and far. And, you know, sometimes that can feel like indirect conflict with some of that nine energy. So it's like, oh no, I don't want to, I don't want to do that. But really, and ironically, I guess um when they take on some of those qualities and step in and start to speak up and share their voice, um, that's when you'll see some of that that massive growth, growth for the type nine. So I'm just curious, Tim, and your experience as type threes are striving to feel outstanding and successful. Um they're known as the achievers sometimes on the Enneagram. How have you seen or have you seen that energy influence your own career, work, life as you grow as a type nine?

SPEAKER_01 27:49

Yeah, you know, type nines think all type threes are narcissist. I mean, it's sort of like this, oh, here he goes again, right? Which obviously that's a joke. I don't believe that. But it is, you know, for us, we want to be um, you know, leading from the second share people, right? You we don't need to be upstage on the front stage talking to people. Um so there is that component of you know, always having in the back of your head like what people are thinking, how you're coming across, you know, are you are you, you know, is it all about you? Things like that are always something that's part of, at least for my thinking. And you know, uh running a nonprofit, um, starting and being executive directors, you are put a lot of times in sort of limelight scenario situations. Um, and you have to be able to articulate clearly, you know, the mission and vision. Um, you have to say the right things to the right people because donate, you know, donations are on the line, things like that. So there is a component where you have to um, you know, be you have to be good at those things. Um, so you know, that's the whole extrovert-introvert conversation, too. I am an extrovert, I enjoy being around people, I don't enjoy being in front of large amounts of people. If I could keep the group to five to ten, that would be perfect. And um, you know, so I don't know if that answers that question where you're going with that, but yeah, I don't um so here's why I would actually I would answer that. I do like so we started this nonprofit uh you know 10 years ago, me and my co-founder, and we're both sort of nine. So we hate being up front, we don't want to be the charismatic leader, but what it has helped us to do is identify those folks who are you have those strengths, and um, and then we leverage those strengths, you know, we put them in positions where they can be what I would say, you know, our spokesman on things because they they are really good at articulating, getting people excited, you know, rah-rah, re-ing them, all that stuff. Um, and then we tend to be a little bit more behind the scenes people. Um, and we're totally okay with that. Um, we have no desire to be the you know, the star of the show, which I think is actually very beneficial in the long run when it comes to outcomes and objectives of what we're trying to do with the nonprofit. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:27

I'm glad you mentioned that because one of the questions I always get, no matter what what the setting is, is okay, great information. Now how do I actually use this? And I think exactly what you just said, one of the biggest benefits is that by understanding your own strengths and and natural gifts and preferences, you then also by default kind of start to understand where you're not so strong at or where you don't enjoy. And then it's like, okay, let's um find people who can fill those gaps and really become a well-rounded, strong team. So I'm glad you brought that up. Um, as we start to wrap this up, Tim, um, I I want to um hear from you a little on what we should know if we are working, living, existing with a nine in our life. And uh I know um I put together a list of some pet peeves of what I hear as a nine. Some of them, you know, I won't, I won't read, but um, for listeners who catch this replay on the podcast, some of them are being overlooked, um, maybe pressured to make a decision quickly. Um, not being consulted about a big decision or a project from your manager or the CEO, whoever it might be. Um, and then maybe even kind of having your easy-going nature taken advantage of, or just some of those pet peeves I hear. Um, curious at what you would add to this list, Tim. And then I have a couple questions about what we need to know about working with type 9 energy. Any pet peeves you'd add to this?

SPEAKER_01 32:10

Um, I think I don't know if I see it on there, but people because you're not speaking, right? There's just an assumption that you're not thinking. Um and it's not necessarily that you don't have thoughts, it's that you don't have good thoughts, right? There's that there's not sort of ideas or things that you're not going to say unless you're completely certain of them. So um, you know, it's I guess that's part of being overlooked, but just understand that a nine is actually, you know, one of the more intelligent, much more intelligent people in the room. You know, I say that, right? Um, patting myself on the back. But they really are from the standpoint of they don't necessarily speak before they are pretty certain of what they believe or understand to be true. Um, so don't overlook their lack of of voice as not caring or not thinking.

SPEAKER_00 33:06

Such a good one. Such a good one. Um, what if uh okay, so you're a a a leader here, um type nine leader. What should somebody who is also in a leadership role in a company or as an entrepreneur? Um what should their team know, who maybe is not a type 9, um, somebody that is reporting to them, what should they know about a type 9 leadership style?

SPEAKER_01 33:35

Um, I think the first thing is that just because we don't ask for it doesn't mean we don't want it or need it. Um, so you know it is something that I have to work on in my leadership style is communicating expectations that I have from my team and teammates. So that would be the first thing. I think the other thing is um don't be afraid to ruffle our feathers from the standpoint of making us uncomfortable about certain things, you know. Um there are certain things times where we don't want to make a move because we're trying to figure out what's the best move, um, or we're just not trying to, you know, again upset the boat or whatever, and we do need to be pushed. So um even though it we may come across as irritated or not liking it, it's actually really good for us and more importantly, good for the team. Now, you have to use some discernment with that, right? I mean, if you have a real immature nine, you don't want to tick off your boss because you're constantly being a you know a burr in their saddle, but you you know, use some social intelligence in in communicating that. But you know, for me, I need to be pushed at times. And it's it's helpful for me to have someone irritate me a little bit. So I don't know if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 34:59

Yeah, that's really good. And and maybe your answer to this next question will be the same. But if you have anything to add, please do. Um, thinking of it kind of in the reverse. So if you if you are a leader but not a type nine, but are leading somebody um who you think has some of that type nine energy, what should we know about helping them get to the next level, uh achieving their goals, communicating better with that person?

SPEAKER_01 35:30

Yeah, so I think you know, one of the important things that I've learned about that is use eye language with them. Um, so what you don't want to do with a nine is make them feel like they're cornered or that you are sort of assigning a feeling, emotion, action, thought to them. So, you know, using words like, man, if I were you, I would be thinking this. Or, you know, you know, I find myself to to be really afraid and you know, using eye language with that is, I mean, that's really across all relationships, to be honest. You should never try to assign emotion or motivation to someone, it's not your job, and you you're not qualified unless you're God to do that. Um, so using eye language, I think would be the most important thing. I do think that you know it's a probably a lot easier because you're not a nine to sort of spur and push a nine to to action and seeing things, you know. I I would use the uh the courage piece of challenging them to do the right thing, even though it's the hard thing. Or um, you know, and again, use language that would not be saying that I don't think you're courageous, but you know, I I just want to inspire, you know, we want to be courageous here, and this is how we do it. We so talk about stuff in a way that um sort of points them to this idea or feeling of what the right thing is, not maybe what the easy thing is to do, um, you know, and always just respect them as a person. Um, you know, no one likes to think that someone doesn't think they're a real person with real feelings and real thoughts and you know, intelligence.

SPEAKER_00 37:15

So is there anything that we should be aware of that we should just like try to never say or never do to the nines in our life?

SPEAKER_01 37:29

Great question. Um, I don't know. That's that's uh you know, I always think that uh challenging anyone's sort of identity is a sort of a bad idea, um, especially nines who are gonna be very, you know, already insecure with the fact that they know that they're peacekeepers, not necessarily makers. Um, so just be very careful in how you challenge them. Um, because the what'll the opposite will happen, which is instead of leaning in, they'll lean, they'll continue to lean out. Um, and so use language that would be you know sensitive to the fact that there's some insecurity. I mean, we all know us nines already know that we struggle with those things. We don't need necessary, you know, someone to challenge us to along those lines. At least just be careful the way that you you bring that stuff up. Um, but yeah, I don't know. That was kind of a vague answer.

SPEAKER_00 38:31

Yeah, I think I think that's good. Yeah, no, I think I think that's good. Um, just yeah, just kind of how how you bring it up, um, even if it's not so much what, but just kind of that that how, like you were saying with the I statements and and that sort of thing. So I think that was great. Um anything else? I want to ask you where people can find you. So I want to hear that. And then after that, I want to we'll close out with any final thoughts um that I haven't asked you about today. So um, as far as learning more about you, connecting with you, fellow nine, saying, Oh my gosh, Tim, it was so great. You're in my head. Um, where can they do that? Where's the best place to connect with you and learn more about you?

SPEAKER_01 39:13

Um, I mean, my LinkedIn is a good place for that. Uh, basically, the two orgs that I'm uh really deeply involved in is Blink Tech, and then also Ala Vale Group. So one is the tech firm that I run the sales team for, and the other one is a nonprofit that I started. Um, and I'm sure you can probably put those in the show notes as well. Um, but yeah, look me up on LinkedIn, Tim Brockup. I mean, that I'm a very big I like to, you know, I'm a I'm a lifelong learner, so I'm always trying to understand how people think and new ideas, and LinkedIn's been great for me on that. So that's a good place to look me up. Um, I have Instagram, but I don't do much on that, to be honest.

SPEAKER_00 39:57

So okay, okay. Yeah, so definitely we'll we'll add those two um companies or organizations to the show notes, and then it's Tim, and then it's uh B-R-O-K-O-P over on LinkedIn. Um, and then to close this out, Tim, anything else that you would add about your own personal experience or growth or transformation um as a nine, learning about yourself, self-awareness in general, um, to add to kind of make this investigation complete.

SPEAKER_01 40:30

Yeah, you know, I would just the thing about the Enneagram is it really just helps you understand what motivates people, right? What why they do things, why they think certain ways, how they posture themselves. And that becomes hugely important in your interpersonal relationships with your, you know, your partner, your children, your the people you work with. But you know, even over on the sales side, I use that every day in talking to clients and trying to understand what motivates them and how they're seeing things. You know, we're all we're all mammals, which means that we make decisions based off of emotions. Um, and and really understanding what someone, you know, how they're motivated and how they see stuff is really important in positioning the product you're trying to sell them, not to take advantage of it, but really position it in a way that would help them understand fully what it is you're selling. And then obviously, you know, just if you understand why someone is acting the way that they are, whether again they're a partner, your son or daughter, or you know, a teammate, it allows for you to have so much more grace and empathy and actually your communication skills will go, you know, you'll actually be able to communicate well. Um, so those things, you know, just check it out. And it, you know, some people think it's it's weird, but I'm just telling you, it's it's really rev revolutionized the way that I'm able to connect and communicate with people that I'm associated with every day. So it's worth worth your time.

SPEAKER_00 42:01

Yeah, I'm so glad you said that. What a great way to end. And uh with that, Tim, I appreciate you so much for taking the time to share and open up. And I know you know our personality is kind of one of the most um kind of sensitive and personal things. So I appreciate you opening up and sharing what you did. And uh, we will see you around LinkedIn.

SPEAKER_01 42:22

Yeah, no problem. Thanks so much, Sarah.

SPEAKER_00 42:31

When I'm not planning for the next episode or getting to interview the next podcast guest, I'm probably out doing an Enneagram team training or a group workshop experience. Because while Enneagram MBA is a podcast, it is also a team training company, which means whether you have a team of four or 40 or are planning an event for 400 people, there is an experience that is waiting to be created just for you and your team or organization or event. And I'm gonna invite you to start that process over at enneagrammba.com where you'll be able to check out some of the initial ideas and options and then reach out to get in touch to start planning your own.