SPEAKER_01 0:00

If you are someone who is still on their typing journey and you happen to be stuck between am I a three, am I a seven? Am I an eight? Some sort of combination of our high energy types, as we call them, this bonus episode is for you. This is a section that was taken from a recent interview that Dee Parker, one of our Enneagram MBA uh workshop facilitators and leadership coaches and I had together to talk about the high-energy team dynamics and the growth opportunities for these three types specifically. Prior to getting into the meat of it, we ended up having a really good conversation around some of the differences, some of the similarities, but also some of the differences between these three types. And this was extra interesting because D most resonates with a type three. I most resonate as a type seven. We both have had a lot of opportunity to work with three sevens and also eights in the different coaching and workshop facilitation uh work that we get to do. And so we are bringing in some personal experience from our own day-to-day lives, our personal experience from uh professional settings and then uh just kind of Enneagram theory, what we've seen. And so I'm hoping that while this may not be the final stop on your typing journey, that you will continue to pick up some clues, some additional data points to help you continue to clarify, to reflect on some things maybe you haven't reflected on, maybe validate some things that you have been feeling, that you have been thinking along your typing journey. And so, with that, here is a bonus clip from, and I say clip, I think it's about 30 minutes or so from our uh full interview on the high energy types. Now, if you want to go back and listen to that episode, I highly recommend that because there we get into more of the kind of the chemistry between these three types, as well as these three types and the dynamics between the other six types. So, really interesting conversation. Um, if you happen to be a three, seven or an eight, or if you happen to be working or leading a type three, seven, or eight, I think this will also be really helpful. So uh we're gonna do the other six at some point. So be on the lookout for that. But for today, here is our type three, striving to feel outstanding, our type seven, striving to feel excited, and our type eight, striving to feel powerful. Enjoy. You're listening to the Enneagram at Work Podcast, a show about understanding people at work, including yourself. I'm your host, Sarah Wallace, and I'm looking forward to diving into this week's episode with you. So we're we're starting off with this episode, and it's it's the perfect one for both of us because Dee identifies most as a type three, I identify most as a type seven. But before we hit record, we were just talking about how much all three of these really resonate with us in different ways. And what I have found, and I would love to hear your take on this, Dee, is that a lot of times when we, when somebody is struggling to identify their type, am I a three, seven, or an A? Or uh in the initial assessment, it's like these three tend to be towards the top. Of course, not always, but it's like it's it's not uncommon to see, oh, you ranked high as a three and then A and then, so some order of this. And there's a lot of similarities, and we're gonna talk about the similarities and the differences today. But what do you what do you see when people are kind of identifying starting the initial typing process as a three, seven, or an eight?

SPEAKER_02 4:03

Yeah, no, to your point, I that's typically what I see are, you know, they'll say, Oh, uh these three scored highest, or you know, even for myself, I've taken many assessments. Um, you know, trying the different ones out and seeing what's out there. And um, there's been times where, you know, the three and a seven for me, typically they will fluctuate. Three more than seven, and then eight will always be like a third. Um but they're always my three highest, no matter what uh assessment that I've taken. And so for me, it's that kind of like a lot of things in Instagram, I I will challenge folks to say which one punches you in the gut, right? So not the because we like all the positive things, you know.

SPEAKER_00 4:50

Oh, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 4:52

Like, oh yeah, I want this, I want success, I want that, you know, I want freedom, I want control. So it's easy to identify and say, Well, I want all of that. But then when you think about that thing that punches you in the gut, you know, the fear, the the negative side, the negative side of the that's when you're like, oh okay, that's the one.

SPEAKER_01 5:15

The overuse strengths. It's like, oh shoot.

SPEAKER_02 5:20

That's that. That's the thing right there.

SPEAKER_01 5:23

Okay, so out of curiosity, and I will have to think about this too. Um, what what is the thing? Is there something specific that punched you in the gut about the type three overuse strengths or the shadow side that led you to believe, okay, I'm definitely a three versus a seven or an eight?

SPEAKER_02 5:47

Yeah. Um wow, going right for it, huh?

SPEAKER_01 5:52

Um, so this is yeah, this is bust right into it.

SPEAKER_02 5:58

Um yeah, no, so that thing, so growing up, so I grew up in the hood of DC. Um and I was, you know, I was I was geeky, I was a nerd. Um at one point I I got the I got the name the cool ass nerd because I did play sports and I could fight. Um but I was into books and all those kinds of things. So it was it was this weird space. Um but I remember because I was you know more on the nerdiest side than a lot of my friends um and peers. I remember at some point I always say, I don't care what they think. I don't care what they think. Um and so but I realized I do care. The things that I do, the accomplishments, yes, I want to be successful, yes, I want to be valued, uh, valuable, but that's just it. I also realized not only did I want to be valuable, I want to be valued, and I want to be valued. Um and so with that, that was the thing that I was like, oh like it was that was that saying you protest too much. Um when I was saying, I don't care, they think, I don't care what they think. And people are like, well, no one even asks you if you care what they think. So why are you sharing that?

SPEAKER_01 7:32

So yeah, so what's that saying?

SPEAKER_02 7:36

Oh, no one said that I guess I do care. So yeah. So anyway, so that's how that was that gut punch for me when I was like, oh crap. And and sometimes it rears just ugly hits now. Like if I, you know, if a client doesn't call me back in and you know, like at a specific time, there's times where I'm like, oh, could I do something? Did I say something? And I gotta whoa. No, no, no, no, no. I have to pop myself off that ledge and be like, whoa.

unknown 8:06

Oh.

SPEAKER_02 8:06

So anyway, so that's you know, that's the one for me.

SPEAKER_01 8:10

That is, and and uh, I mean, that's very uh you know, vulnerable for anyone to admit, but especially to your point, if you're like have told yourself for so long that you don't care, to be like, oh dang, actually I do care. I mean, that's a lot of bravery even to yourself. Recently, I was in a workshop um, and there when we did our type specific breakout groups, the type three group, um, had probably the most powerful aha. And it really impacted the CEO of this organization because they had shared, similar to your point, it really means a lot to me. Cause I think the conversation was around pet peeves and preferences. And they had said, you know, it really means a lot to us when you tell us good job. Like it's it's a given that we're gonna do a good job. And we know that. But if you could say it more and be more specific about what was good about what we did, like we just eat that up. And the the leadership, um, the CEO of this organization was a type A. And he said, you know, I do always just expect that you will do a great job because you always do. And we're on to the next goal, we're on to the next thing. But understanding that that means so much to you, like I really want to take the time to slow down and specifically like pull you aside or give you some specific feedback. And I thought, oh my gosh, what a what a great aha on on both ends. And to be able to to articulate that as a three, to say, like, hey, this means a lot to me.

SPEAKER_02 9:49

Yeah, no, I'm saying that so so you know you gotta share yours. You do know that, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:54

Yes, I do. I was gonna say before we before we jump to the seven, just a quick refresher for anybody who's like, what exactly? So the three is striving to feel outstanding, um, looking to be successful, be seen as successful, have accomplishments. Um I I would I always say I think we have a lot of type three vibes in the US anyway. Um so a lot of that is just kind of baked in. Um, any any, I mean, kind of high level, anything you would add to the three description?

SPEAKER_02 10:28

I I would I would say kind of what you just hit on, right? You know, threes of running on that. Am I winning? Make sense. Am I winning? Am I doing the thing? Um so yeah. So that's fine. Yeah. What did you want to say? There's no try, there's just do.

SPEAKER_01 10:52

Yeah, yeah. There you go.

unknown 10:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:55

Um, okay, so uh yeah, our our threes, and then um there is a lot, there are a lot of similarities between the other two. The the next one is the type seven who's striving to feel excited, wanting that freedom, flexibility options. Um, you know, keep it, let's just keep high vibing, you know, keep a positive uh outlook on life. And for me, there are definitely a lot of things with the three that I see because of course, who doesn't want to be outstanding? Who doesn't want to be successful? And I do care what people think. Like I I absolutely do. Um, and may, you know, and maybe some of that is that transmitting undertone. And I don't know how much we're gonna get into that, but there's the instinctual biases there too. And I am, I do love to just, you know, just jump in and figure it out as you go. It's like, oh, I don't need a plan. I'll just we'll just do this. Um and there are a lot of things that I see myself. I also really struggled in the beginning between a seven and a two. And now it's like, how did I ever think I was a two?

unknown 12:04

I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 12:05

But it's some of it's like, oh, this is who I think I should be. And that also will flavor that your typing process and make it complicated. Yeah. Um, but to your point, it was like, well, gosh, okay. So if I'm reading the type three, how they overdo their strengths, it's like setting unrealistic expectations, taking on too much, doing it for recognition, overdoing, bringing attention to their themselves or their accomplishments sometimes, maybe hard to get to know. I'm like, you know, maybe, maybe some of that I struggle with. But when I got to the overused strengths of the seven, to your point, that was where I was like, you don't know me. But it's like, oh, literally every problem that I've had in my life is like because of these overuse strengths, whether it's like career, relationship, family dynamics, I mean, just anything. And so, you know, the ability to follow through. I was just talking to a friend the other day, and I I mean, no surprise, D. Um, I have a new idea about something completely unrelated to the Enneagram. And I was like, I'm not gonna do anything, but I just want to talk about it. And I was like, I just, I just love talking about new ideas. It's like I I would just snort new ideas like cocaine. Like, it's just like, give me all the new ideas and let's brainstorm and let's come up with names. But then, like when it comes to like, how would we do this? Like, what would the like the money model be? What would and I'm like, uh, snooze fest. That's not fun anymore. So I, you know, there are a lot of things I see in myself with the others, but where I get myself derailed in life is all the things with the seven, sadly.

SPEAKER_02 13:52

Yeah, no, no, no. I mean, that makes sense because you know, you think about those things, and I'm sure that folks are listening, they may say, but yeah, I want that too. And that's the hard part. Um because yeah, yeah, I can resonate at times with you on that space where I'm like, oh, you know, shiny. Oh but then for me, it's coming back and going, What? How do I make that actionable? Right. So that's that's that I can I can go in that space, but then I'm I'm I gotta make it I gotta make it actionable so that I can win.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

Um Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:38

Um tell me if then okay I'm sorry, I was laughing because I was thinking about so you know I'm very competitive.

SPEAKER_00 14:47

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_02 14:50

And so in my household. And now, I'm very competitive. I don't mind losing. Oh. Like I really don't mind losing. It just doesn't happen a lot, like in games, like board games. So in our household, my wife has literally gone and got a wooden clapmaid that says, because we do a lot of game nights, we host a lot of game nights, and it literally says, if Demetrius loses, we all win. That's the house rule. And I'm like, really? Like, that's the house. I came home and she was so happy with this flaps. Like, look, look how I got a and she shows it, and now my son, like, he's he jumps on it. And so if she doesn't bring it up, he will literally run and get it if we're doing a game night. And he goes, Hey Ma, we gotta do the house rules, so everyone knows.

SPEAKER_01 15:47

So yeah, that is hilarious. At first, I thought you were going with like she got you a plaque because she knows like how much you need it as a win, like whenever you win. Yes, that's that's some of that ruthless. Okay, okay. Oh, that's good, that's good. Well, um, there there are uh several people that will come across their uh in their typing journey, like, am I a three or am I a seven? And I would be curious on your take on this or anything you would add. But they, I mean, there are so many similarities. And I I think that overall, threes are pretty optimistic too. Like they have a lot of confidence in their abilities and their skills and their ability to succeed. Um, so there there are several similarities. But what um I had one of my clients came on as one of our clients came on as a podcast guest who was a type three, and she shared her detest for brainstorming sessions. She said, call me when you guys get done, and then you have the the board full of like to-dos, due dates, and goals. And I'm like, oh my God, I love whiteboarding. I love being like so. We were talking about how that could be an indicator, like your tolerance or enjoyment for brainstorming. Threes typically don't love to pontificate on like possibilities, and sevens sometimes like like me, it's like, oh my god, that's so fun and addicting.

SPEAKER_02 17:33

Yeah, see, and and that's an interesting one, because that's one of those ones where I'm saying again. I think it depends on because to me that sounds more like an eight. Like an eight to me, doesn't want to be in there. Unless I can children because it's gonna take too much time. Like when I think about the eight I work with, they're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Why why? Just make the decision. Just do it. I don't mind Yeah, I don't mind having those those brainstorming sessions. As long as again, as long as we come out with actions. So that's where for me I like I can do it, but we have to come out with something that we're doing. If that doesn't happen, that's what I do. That's what I'm like, okay, hold on. No, no. Interesting, so that's very interesting.

SPEAKER_01 18:32

I thought it was interesting, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

You know. But to your point, and I don't know if that's because that's the transmitting side of me. Where, you know, that whole thing, and again, we we probably don't want to get off culture of what we're supposed to be focusing on today. Um, but I think that could be part of that coloring.

SPEAKER_01 18:57

Yeah. Well, I I think there is, I mean, there is a significant um expression, difference in the expression of the type when you consider a transmitting three versus a preserving three, who almost looks like a type one. So in an in another workshop, there was a gentleman who had a lot of vibes like you, D. Like he had um really fun glasses. Every time I saw him, he was in, I mean, just really like tailored clothes, but they were bright. And it was never too much, but it was just like you could tell. And that he like really paid attention and curated, just really, you know, uh, what's the word?

SPEAKER_02 19:38

Uh I like you use that word curated.

SPEAKER_01 19:40

Yeah, yeah. Just, you know, he had a look going on. He definitely had like a brand. Like his brand was this like well-dressed but brightly well-dressed man. And then right next to him was his coworker who also identified as a type three. Um, but it was like, I don't know. I how can we both be the same type? And we got down to it, and he's like, okay, he's kind of more of that preserving. He had on like levies, like a just rant random button-up, you know, flannel shirt. He's like, I don't care about my outfits. I don't, I don't care about this, I don't need the recognition as much. And so the the instinctual biases definitely flavor that as well as your life experiences, you know, birth order, child, all this stuff. But um, I think that that is one that I often see is the preserving three and the preserving or the transmitting eight who are oh gosh, I can't talk preserving three and the transmitting three who are like, how can we be the same type? There might I must be another type. If you're this type, I must be a different one.

SPEAKER_02 20:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:51

So okay, so we have we have those, and and then the last one in the what is known as the I guess assertive kind of high energy group, um, is the type eight. How do you describe the type eight?

SPEAKER_02 21:08

Uh what was that song back in the 90s? I got the power.

SPEAKER_00 21:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:16

You know, they want the control, the power, uh, you know, can't feel weak. Um, so that that's that's what I think about like those eights. If you want a decision made, age will make the decision. Like they will okay, it's really done. So yeah, that's kind of how I think about when I think about H. So it's the first thing to come to mind for me.

SPEAKER_01 21:42

I uh my brother is a type 8, and um, I actually had him on the podcast as one of my first guests, like three years ago. And I I got a memory a couple weeks ago from that interview, and it was a clip of him where I had asked him, like, what What advice would you have for other entrepreneurs or people thinking about opening their own or something like that? And his advice was literally just do it. Just do it. Just do it. Just do it. I mean, he just was like, he would try and like say something else, but then would just come back to like, just do it. And it's like, oh, sure, I'll just do it. It's like no step by step. It's like no explain, just just push through and do it. And uh that is so like Nike is the ultimate type eight slogan, I think. Just do it. Um, just for fun. I have Jeep slogan, go anywhere, do anything for seven, and then for three. Oh, it's Weedies, Breakfast for Champions is the brand. So yeah, I was like, I guess, yeah. So just just for fun. Um, but the eights, I I have found that in the initial typing, eights, especially women, it is kind of um it's not as as it's not as always as straightforward. Because we talk about eights tend to know more than anybody. Like it's very clear. It's like if you're considering, am I an eight or a one, you're probably a one. If you're am I an eight or a three, you're probably a three. You know, not always, but um some some men, some women too will say, like, I don't know that I need, I don't have to be the boss. Like, I don't know that like I don't have to like powerful. That that feel that sounds weird. I don't, I don't know, but it's the power to produce a result, the power to make something happen. And when you kind of frame it like that, people are like, oh yeah, yeah, I do like, but I don't know, any any experience in your workshops or working with clients around their I would say it's interesting.

SPEAKER_02 23:59

So people who have a some people have a uh aversion to the word power. Because they're like, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't want, and especially in today's space, um, that word tends to be almost kind of going a negative space of of power. Um but at the same time, if you ask them about having control and having to control things, if they if they're honest with themselves, typically they'll go, oh okay, yeah, yeah, I guess. But but who doesn't, right? And they know, you know, but who doesn't? You're like, well a lot of us. And especially to the level that you have to control things. And I specifically I would say with a lot of the women in my workshops, they respond better to that word because then they're like, oh yeah. And especially when they're thinking about it from a work perspective. But even some of them in their household are like, no, I control like I need because they you know, and the thing is because if I don't, who's gonna do it?

SPEAKER_00 25:07

Right.

SPEAKER_02 25:08

If I don't, who's gonna do it?

SPEAKER_00 25:10

Right.

SPEAKER_02 25:10

And so you're like, okay, well there you go. That's that's where you are. So yeah, so that's what I would say that I have found as you talk about family members that are eights. So my father-in-law is an eight, and he lives in Colorado and Boulder, Colorado. Okay, but originally from New York. Oh, so if you know anything about if you know anything about Boulder, Colorado and Brooklyn, New York, totally different, totally different, just like imagining, huh?

SPEAKER_01 25:43

Okay, okay.

SPEAKER_02 25:45

And so one year, uh, for his birthday, we got him this bumper sticker because in Boulder, you know, you drive it around and everyone's on their car, they'll have like, have a nice day, have a nice day. And so we got him this bumper sticker one year that says, Don't tell me what kind of baby.

SPEAKER_00 26:01

Yeah, that's so good.

SPEAKER_02 26:04

And you know, which resonated with him as an eight, because he's like, Don't tell me what kind of babe to have. Like, I'll have a nice day if I have a nice day.

SPEAKER_00 26:11

Yeah, I'll have a nice day if I want to. Exactly. Don't tell me what's it do?

SPEAKER_01 26:16

Yeah, yeah. You know, uh, that's that's so interesting. I kind of think like just like as a vibe, New York City is a type has a lot of type eight vibes. It's just like that direct, say it straight, you know. Uh so that's interesting.

unknown 26:31

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 26:33

Um let's see, the when people, because I I think too, there's a lot of stereotypes around eights being very direct, very confident, decisive, but they can also be so much fun, so incredibly warm at times. Um, and so sometimes I will see people struggle between am I an eight or am I a seven? Because sevens also don't love to be controlled. That freedom is really important. But what I have seen, and please share if you see something different or you have anything to add to this, um, is that I've heard of this term like soft rebellion versus like more direct rebellion. And so how that will typically be expressed is like a seven will soft rebel, and that might be making friends with the manager. So then they don't have to be told now they're friends with the manager and they don't have to follow the rules like everybody else does. But for an eight where it's a little bit more direct, it might be like, no, I'm not doing that, or you know, just a little, you know, a little bit more direct. So I don't know. Any any thoughts? Have you seen that?

SPEAKER_02 27:46

Uh yeah, I would say that was pretty spot off. What I will see is those sevens, and they will find a way to what I call laugh it out, right? They'll find a way to laugh it out, like yeah, that's crazy. I can't believe and then just kind of not do it, right? Versus ace to your point. It's a it's you can tell it, it's a literally like no, yeah, I'm not doing that.

SPEAKER_01 28:15

Yeah, no thanks. Hard pass.

SPEAKER_02 28:17

That's it. That's the end of discussion.